Elevation Centre: Sworded Stylez' Feedback Thread |
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SwordedStylez 
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Joined: 16 August 2007 Location: UK Status: Offline Points: 4922 Audio Rank: Unranked Stats: 3-0-1 Form: WWWN |
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 Topic: Sworded Stylez' Feedback ThreadPosted: 25 June 2014 at 11:03pm |
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As a lot of newer cats are dropping stuff mega-fast in Open Mic and generally gettin ignored - which is annoying the older members as their work is gettin bumped down a page. I've decided to create this thread. Any verse posted in this thread will receive more than the usual amount of feedback and I will dedicate myself to really breaking down the work of anybody who posts. I'd recommend that newer writers use this thread rather than spamming up the open mic, the community won't get as pissed at you and you'll be getting a lot better and detailed feedback than "this isn't good, go and read some guides." Older, more experienced heads who want a really detailed breakdown are welcome aswell, I'm a very inclusive sort of person. Any verse be it keystyle, battle, topical or anything, I WILL put the effort in to feed.
Bear in mind that I will be putting a lot of effort into the feedback I give, so it might not always come quickly, but it WILL always come. Ta.
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Music
Ink - Always remembered, never forgotten (as a fake as fuck piece of shit who tried to steal 2 persona's) |
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Elite
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Joined: 16 February 2014 Location: US Status: Offline Points: 3340 Crew: eNtiTy Audio Rank: #3 Stats: 5-0-0 Form: WWWW |
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Posted: 25 June 2014 at 11:06pm |
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This is a great idea SS, i may drop something I've been working on in here sometime.
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barrybondz
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Posted: 25 June 2014 at 11:24pm |
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sick idea, sorry for the spam. Wish I had your level of skill to be honest.
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SwordedStylez
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Joined: 16 August 2007 Location: UK Status: Offline Points: 4922 Audio Rank: Unranked Stats: 3-0-1 Form: WWWN |
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Posted: 26 June 2014 at 5:03am |
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Look forward to reading work from both of y'all. Like I say, the whole point of this thing is so I can dedicate more time to cats who really need the assistance. I will point out that because I'ma go deep with the feed you might not like a lot of what I say, but I'll back up any criticism with practical techniques you can learn to fix any of the issues. Fair trade off I'd say.
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Music
Ink - Always remembered, never forgotten (as a fake as fuck piece of shit who tried to steal 2 persona's) |
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barrybondz
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Posted: 26 June 2014 at 7:10am |
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They always say tomorrow is a new day Why do I wake up thinking about shit from yesterday Other days I just lay awake like god please give me a break I said please there's never any appease for this ache What does it take? For me to get on my knees praying up to thee I just want to be free as a bird, put my arms out and feel the breeze This life of which we live is just a tease, it doesn't come with ease I just want to forget it all, when we fall we don't stay small Yo I hope you can hear me dawg please help me set fire to everything prior My heart beats cold and life keeps asking me to just fold I have to be bold and give myself a new hold or so I'm told I'm not really so familiar with this style, but here's a crack at it since you like the real stuff. |
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SwordedStylez
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Posted: 26 June 2014 at 5:03pm |
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They always say tomorrow is a new day
Why do I wake up thinking about shit from yesterday Ok, so with these two lines your main issue is the flow. It works actually, but you need to punctuate it a little bit, make it obvious where you want the pause. In this first line it could literally be a pause before the line or after the line which would make the flow dramatically different depending which way you spit it. I'd recommend that when you have a pause you throw a few periods in here "....." in the place where you specifically want the pause, when you control the reader in that way you're able to deliver the verse much closer to how it would be when you spit it out loud. Also, whilst there are certainly many many english language rules broken in every rap verse, you should always use your question marks and exclamation marks to help define the tone used when you rap. As you're posing a question you should still use the question mark, it actually dictates how a word is pronounced so is a valuable tool in aiding your delivery. Other days I just lay awake like god please give me a break I said please there's never any appease for this ache here you're suffering a bit flow wise by your second bar being way shorter than the first in terms of how it actually sounds. Remember you bar length is defined by how many or few syllables you use rather than how it looks on the screen. You need to start reading your stuff out loud I think, you'll be able to hear it much better than you can see it. Furthermore some of your wording is really awkward, "like" in the way you've used it is weak and conveys little meaning, if you'd've changed that to "thinking" it would've been far more coherent and would've also flowed better. Again on the punctuation if you'd thrown some quotations around the "please God give me a break" and other parts when you're effectively quoting your thoughts or words it will again help the presentation and storytelling element of your work. |The great thing about these two though is you're starting to develop more complicated rhymes with a nice slant/multi and the end and some nice little internals. What does it take? For me to get on my knees praying up to thee I just want to be free as a bird, put my arms out and feel the breeze i'm not a fans of thees and thous unless you're using archaic language through the entire piece. I see where you're going with it as you're referring to God, but it kinda comes across a little forced because of the surrounding language. If you're going to go flowery like that, you can't also use "like" in the slang vernacular as it makes the direction of the verse a little confused. Either be poetic or street, you can be both, but the language would be more "street with metaphor" in that case, flowery language looks a little girly when surrounded by a more street approach. Again you're using a couple of internals which is nice to see, I'm not feeling the end-rhyme, I think you could've had something stronger on the first line that would rhyme with "feel the breeze" possibly by rewording and using the knees point more towards the end of the line. This life of which we live is just a tease, it doesn't come with ease I just want to forget it all, when we fall we don't stay small first off "of which we live" have you EVER spoken like that in real life? "the life that we live" sounds much more natural I think. When things start getting wordy like that it's usually because you've rushed and not proof read enough. It should always come across as natural and never over talked when you rap, be economical with your words. If you can use one word to say the exact same thing as you did with many, swap the many for the one. Coherency and clear direction in your lyrics is something that is heavily desirable. Think of every verse you write i terms of how it would sound on a record - "the life that we live" is the way people would say it, so it's the way they expect to hear it to. When you throw out "in which" and similar phrases the awkwardness of the phrase actually harms the way your audience absorbs it, they will hear the awkwardness even if they aren't aware WHY it sounds awkward. You also lost your couplet scheme here which is a shame because you were holding it down well. Just remember, never rhyme in 1's and 3's always rhyme in 2's and 4's. Get them lines to match up in groups of to where you "post a thought, close a thought." like you have with most of the rest of the piece. Yo I hope you can hear me dawg please help me set fire to everything prior this has some nice little rhymes but as it's a "bar on it's own" right after a non-rhyming couplet this bar alone throws your flow out to a point it'd be heard to recover from. like I say, 2's and 4's bro My heart beats cold and life keeps asking me to just fold I have to be bold and give myself a new hold or so I'm told again with the wording "asking me to just fold" sounds very awkward. "asking me to fold" makes for more sense and is less wordy. Try and cut out any pointless words, it'll help you alot with the delivery of your verses. Often a slight rewording can really make the difference in your bars. Also, this feels more like a mid-verse couplet than an ending one. A good thing to aim for is "leave them wanting more." Try and finish on a high point or some great technique or an emotional sentiment, something. You just have to really spike their interest or connection with the material as the very last thing you do, that's one of the marks of a good writer, so aim for that All in all this is by far the best verse I've seen from you. Apart from a little bit towards the end your structure, flow and delivery have jumped up massively by your use of couplets and more coherent thought in your work. Key points for next time: Stick to your scheme - you were doing well here but you let it slip a little, next time, nail it. More of it - this showed some real potential, a standard rap verse for a song is 16 lines, try not to do less than that if you can help it. A full song is often 48-64 lines long, if you want to be a writer you have to be able to give volume. Emotion - i've heard your thoughts and opinions more than i've heard your feelings. It's a tough thing for any writer to do but if you can force yourself to pull up some emotional shit, whether sad or happy, a real emotional connection with your audience will improve your work greatly. Good Job man, lots of improvement there |
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Ink - Always remembered, never forgotten (as a fake as fuck piece of shit who tried to steal 2 persona's) |
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Shankley
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Joined: 03 September 2013 Location: Leeds, England Status: Offline Points: 3369 Crew: Kratos Kind Text Rank: Unranked Stats: 37-43-1 Form: WNLWWL |
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Posted: 26 June 2014 at 10:38pm |
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Scratching a living, going hand to mouth Catching a feeling, things are heading south Things gon' be tight, I'm shortening the purse strings I pray for the night, no stomach hurtings During the day I hustle, trying to make a raise Or something I can rustle, you can't say I waste my days They are spent economically, trying to get some money As hard I try it dont work ironically, I work as hard as bees with honey There is no easy does it, in my world its dog eat dog No such thing as easy money, everyday a game of leap frog Just to try to get ahead, but this stress is taking its toll Never feeling well fed, falling down an endless hole Getting pennies in dole, depression is my only friend All I have is an empty soul, stumbling towards a lonely end |
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SwordedStylez
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Joined: 16 August 2007 Location: UK Status: Offline Points: 4922 Audio Rank: Unranked Stats: 3-0-1 Form: WWWN |
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Posted: 26 June 2014 at 10:44pm |
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Aite Shanks I got you. I'm in the middle of re-mastering my collection of dope cats I like online so they can go on a mix on my iPod without sounding like weak-piss next to Biggie tracks haha. I'll have the feed up in the next couple hours and send you a pm when it's done.
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Music
Ink - Always remembered, never forgotten (as a fake as fuck piece of shit who tried to steal 2 persona's) |
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Shankley
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Joined: 03 September 2013 Location: Leeds, England Status: Offline Points: 3369 Crew: Kratos Kind Text Rank: Unranked Stats: 37-43-1 Form: WNLWWL |
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Posted: 26 June 2014 at 10:46pm |
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Yeah no worries man, get to it when you can.
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barrybondz
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Posted: 26 June 2014 at 11:44pm |
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Godamn SS, you go so in depth its wicked. This is exactly what a noobie like me needs in order to improve. Who would have known there is so much techique to really good rap, so many people think they can just wing it and they are so wrong.
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SwordedStylez
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Posted: 27 June 2014 at 12:41am |
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Scratching a living, going hand to mouth
Catching a feeling, things are heading south ok, firstly, your flow is really on point. However. It's also fairly uninteresting in terms of overall movement. You have a really nice pulse going but adding some embellishments into your schemes/verses could really open up your style and give you more interesting work. Here;s a little tip for you. Find a nice steady hiphop beat, nothing fancy (in fact let me know if you're struggling and I'll knock up a "verse writing" beat you can use to write to) and spit your lyrics out over it. You'll see that though you're fully on-beat with that pause/slow delivery you have a ton more room (about a whole beat by my reckoning if you were rapping at "normal speed") to throw some shit in. I'd recommend that you start to add embellishments AFTER your pause comma. As an example I'll keystyle some stuff into your bars so you can see what I mean about adding "movement" to the flow Scratching a living, shit is really going hand to mouth Catching a feeling, head is reeling, things are heading south You see how those few extra words actually give more "roll" to the flow? You're very lucky really, most textcees have to cut their shit down, with you a couple of extra words or internal rhymes and you'll take a huge jump up in flow and delivery Things gon' be tight, I'm shortening the purse strings I pray for the night, no stomach hurtings similarly a few more words to sculpt the flow and story would massively improve your bars here. Sometimes you're actually so economical with your words that I could double them up over a beat if I wanted. When you write so economically it can actually slightly harm how well it would fit over a beat. An american guy with a thick accent would find this easier on a regular 4/4 rap beat, I personally would have to leave half of the beat with a pause or stretch my words right out. - as you're in Yorkshire, and in fact a part of Yorkshire that's close to Lancashire/Greater Manchester I'd imagine your accent (despite prolly pronouncing "no" as "nerr" lol) is not too far from my own. This means that you'll have a lot more short vowels than long ones when you spit, that makes it very hard to spit such short lines effectively. I'd work on some cheeky little inernals, playing on some of the words in your end rhyme, or even completely different compound schemes within each line. During the day I hustle, trying to make a raise Or something I can rustle, you can't say I waste my days Often in your verses, you could replace those little "rest" commas with a "and i'm" or a "so" or any short bridging phrase and it'd actually boost your flow from very basic to something with more bounce to it. You've got sound instincts when you write, hustle/rustle is a nice internal drop-scheme and I like your way of doin it, it just needs to get a little more technical if you wanna "hang with the big boys" as a writer (so to speak) They are spent economically, trying to get some money As hard I try it dont work ironically, I work as hard as bees with honey the second line here is actually at "spittable" length but the wording is clumsy. "As hard I try it don't" is very wordy and really over-talked. Try to "power-word" your shit. You want to try and not use 5 words where 2 will have the exact same meaning, it's similar to when people talk in over-flowery ways, it sounds really odd to the ears. In rap, "what sounds best" is always the best rule of thumb to use There is no easy does it, in my world its dog eat dog No such thing as easy money, everyday a game of leap frog technique-wise this is my favourite couplet of the verse, it flows very nice with a variation in rhythm, you're using a good amount of works and decent rhymes, the easy does it/easy money is a nice repetition, works well for the piece. I like these Just to try to get ahead, but this stress is taking its toll Never feeling well fed, falling down an endless hole actually here removing "but" from the first line would've made these flow very smooth. I think the overall delivery could be better with stronger end-rhymes with better syllable matching, but that's something we all have to work on especially when we're less experienced, this isn't bad at all Getting pennies in dole, depression is my only friend All I have is an empty soul, stumbling towards a lonely end
see here "pennies in dole" that sounds weird. Have you ever head anyone say "i'm in dole?" Having been "on the dole" myself, I'm far more used to that terminology, which makes this read kinda weird. This is a case of forcing a rhyme and losing coherency because of it. Remember a rhyme should always work FOR a verse, never against it  Overall I liked the verse, I think you got better as you went on which is better than starting strong and getting progressively weaker. I'd suggest working on tightening your multies and adding some little internals and embellishments to up your flow. Finally, don't be scared to use a few more words to lengthen your lines a little bit. You have room to breathe than most emcees of your level don't have with their over-worded over written bars. You've got nice flow and good content, now it's time to mature that content by focusing your words and seeing where you can go with a little more in-depth thought. Good work |
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Music
Ink - Always remembered, never forgotten (as a fake as fuck piece of shit who tried to steal 2 persona's) |
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SwordedStylez
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Joined: 16 August 2007 Location: UK Status: Offline Points: 4922 Audio Rank: Unranked Stats: 3-0-1 Form: WWWN |
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Posted: 27 June 2014 at 12:42am |
That's the point of the thread bro. If people leave stuff in here there's less chance I'll miss it like I might if it was in open mic, and it also gives me the time to really break stuff down and give more valuable advice. |
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Music
Ink - Always remembered, never forgotten (as a fake as fuck piece of shit who tried to steal 2 persona's) |
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Shankley
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Joined: 03 September 2013 Location: Leeds, England Status: Offline Points: 3369 Crew: Kratos Kind Text Rank: Unranked Stats: 37-43-1 Form: WNLWWL |
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Posted: 27 June 2014 at 1:23am |
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Thanks for your time Rob very in depth analysis and great feed. This littke verse I was just vibing of H4ZEs verse. I'll take on board what you said and try to implement it in future work. You have been a massive help, it is greatly appreciated.
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SwordedStylez
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Posted: 27 June 2014 at 1:35am |
That's why I made the thread man. Feel free to post any verse of any length. I've always got the time to break a verse down, and it;s better than people feelin slept on in OM all the time I reckon.
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Music
Ink - Always remembered, never forgotten (as a fake as fuck piece of shit who tried to steal 2 persona's) |
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barrybondz
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Posted: 27 June 2014 at 6:18am |
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It's a two way street, I was in this shit with both feet We made an oath to walk down this road together complete Suddenly you start acting discrete like I was obsolete Never mistreated you once, yet you made me feel conceited I never even cheated, and the situation wasn't even heated Now I walk down this road all alone, I'm forever on my own This street is too narrow, it's just a one way arrow Maybe I'll drown my sorrow with another bottle Wake up tomorrow feeling down with no foot on the throttle There's no healing for this blow that life's been dealing |
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SwordedStylez
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Posted: 27 June 2014 at 6:24am |
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I got you barry, bit busy right now, I'll send you a pm when the feed's up.
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Music
Ink - Always remembered, never forgotten (as a fake as fuck piece of shit who tried to steal 2 persona's) |
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barrybondz
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Posted: 27 June 2014 at 6:29am |
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No worries bro haha this looks like so much more on my phone its hilarious
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barrybondz
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Posted: 27 June 2014 at 7:09pm |
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Here's another ss, I posted a shorter version on open mic
Raps got me in a snare and I can't get this shit square! These people keep telling me find a new gig asap! I'm on a drought, trying to figure out what I'm about I won't give up no, it's time to get up and spit rhymes! I'm doing this climb, it's part time, maybe it's sublime These times are hard and I'm doing the longest yard! Once I get my chance, I won't look back no I'm gonna step up and show you people what I'm about yo! I pack pep in my lines, don't give a fuck about my rep! Step in front of me and I'll show you a misstep I used to mutter under my breath when I was much younger I'm going to make the world shutter because I no longer stutter! I'm a grown man and I think my fucking covers been blown Throw me a bone and I'll be more than john doe Had a run in with these hoes running with a gun Had far too much fun popping these bitches cherries Chopping these canaries up like blue berries wrath of Aries! |
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SwordedStylez
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Posted: 27 June 2014 at 7:17pm |
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It's a two way street, I was in this shit with both feet
We made an oath to walk down this road together complete Suddenly you start acting discrete like I was obsolete here again you've fallen into the trap of rhyming 3 lines instead of 2 or 4, remember keep it EVEN. it's a real shame as well because you flow quite nicely here, but by ending "obsolete" without rhyming the next line, the though feels unfinished and your flow drops off. I love the wording in the second line though, you're definitely improving your flow Never mistreated you once, yet you made me feel conceited I never even cheated, and the situation wasn't even heated if you dropped "even" before "heated" that would actually be a very solid 2 lines man. I'm impressed actually, you're elevating your shit. Nice internals, good syllable counts (though i think dropping even improves the flow) well paced lines, you got the "pose a thought, close a thought" idea down well, nice job. Now I walk down this road all alone, I'm forever on my own This street is too narrow, it's just a one way arrow see this frustrates me a little. You had 2 really great lines, then you went back to 1 line rhyming and it's lost you all the momentum that you were building. This is a real shame actually, if you inserting another line inbetween these that rhymed with "own" and another after which rhymed with arrow then this might've been ok. STICK TO EVEN LINES WHEN YOU ARE RHYMING. RHYMING ODD NUMBERS DOES NOT WORK WELL UNTIL YOU UNDERSTAND MORE ADVANCED TECHNIQUE. I'm not going to say that again. Maybe I'll drown my sorrow with another bottle Wake up tomorrow feeling down with no foot on the throttle again, another nice two lines. This makes it really annoying to read though. You need get some consistency, because when you do it right you're really not a bad writer at all, you just need to focus more and put the effort into getting this consistent. I like these lines, but like your other two good ones, they're ruined by the sloppiness of the rest of the verse There's no healing for this blow that life's been dealing again, it's a 1 line throwaway. You need to focus man Overall you're showing improvement but the consistency is really lacking. When you do it right, you do it well, so stop fucking around and concentrate on your work. Honestly, if you'd've paid attention to what you were doing and rhymed in even numbers instead of all these 3 line rhymes and 1 line rhymes this would've been a solid piece of work, and much better than a lot of newest cats here. Content wise you were good, you're telling something alot more real here, although don't always try to sound so poetic, most rappers aren't, they just rhyme regular or street language, which is actually much easier than trying to write in formal prose or flowery language. Good work, but I want a much more consistent one next time I see you post in the thread. You're better than you think, respect yourself as a writer by getting it right, if you do that your audience will respect you a lot more too. You're showing promise bro, keep at it. |
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Ink - Always remembered, never forgotten (as a fake as fuck piece of shit who tried to steal 2 persona's) |
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SwordedStylez
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Joined: 16 August 2007 Location: UK Status: Offline Points: 4922 Audio Rank: Unranked Stats: 3-0-1 Form: WWWN |
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Posted: 27 June 2014 at 7:18pm |
aite bet man, I'll get to this one later tonight, finally got my headphones so I need to record my topical for rapper t and some other shit for various people/my guides lol. |
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Ink - Always remembered, never forgotten (as a fake as fuck piece of shit who tried to steal 2 persona's) |
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barrybondz wrote: